Ab-initio PRESSURE-INDUCED INCIDENTS

Summary:

Post here any incidents that you have experienced where external pressure may have been a contributory factor, and help out fellow pilots with theirs.

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Airspace bust

JDPerezgonzalez 23 Oct 2008 02:59

[In behalf of Anonymous user, originally posted on 20 Oct 2008]

On a marginal weather Saturday i was pressured to complete a back to back flight i didnt want to do until the monday. The DI called me up in the morning explaining that the flight should be done today so i could progress to the fligth exam in the following week. I decided to fly it, but was rushed throughout my planning so as to beat the weather moving in, in the afternoon. after a quick prebrief and preflight i was off with another student. Stress levels were high, to beat the weather, and to please the DI which was all being egged on by the moderate turbulence over each leg. All these "holes in the cheese" led to a busting of airspace. On return after nearly getting stuck at our destination, i was not happy to find a report waiting for me to fill out for busting airspace. All forms were filled out and report filed, but now ive learnt it is MY (PIC) desicion whether to fly or not and should never succumb to the pressures from ANYONE!!!!

Last edited on 23 Oct 2008 03:00 by JDPerezgonzalez Show more

Re: Airspace bust

JDPerezgonzalez 23 Oct 2008 03:01

[In behalf of Anonymous user, originally posted on 20 Oct 2008]

KDP (Key Decision Point) #1 is always Go/No Go. Good to know you now know everything is in your discretion, don't let anyone pressure you because end of the day if it goes right its ok, if it goes wrong its your fault.

Re: Airspace bust

dotwikifan 07 Aug 2010 11:33

Yes but I guess DI are under pressure by management too. Its seems like DI try to put pressure on you. Some times when you talk to some DI you tell them that weather is average , their reply will be go and have a look and find it out what it is like there. Common it’s a navigation flight. you would not want to go and do that often. It cost student huge amount of money as we are paying by hours. If you do survey around school many pilots will have similar story like this. It could be good idea to go to school of aviation and let all pilots know about this site. I have been at one of ATP student and I never knew about this site. You might be surprised by the pilot who have story/ experience to tell. What do you think?

Last edited on 09 Aug 2010 04:00 by JDPerezgonzalez Show more

Pressured to go...

onion41 23 Oct 2008 11:48

I was once pressured to fly even though I felt that the weather was going to turn bad. It was my solo nav and I was suppose to fly to Napier and to do so, I need to cross the gorge. I explained to the instructor that judging from the metrological information available, the gorge will be covered my clouds making it impossible for me to return later in the afternoon. But alas, it fell to deaf ears. So I did my pre flight and got my stuff sorted. The instructor signed me out and as I was walking toward my aircraft, I saw that the gorge was already covered by clouds. I returned back to the instructor and told him about it. He cancelled my flight.
I do know that instructors want to push the students for flight, but sometimes, it is good to listen to what the student thinks.

frustrated

faddy 23 Oct 2008 12:45

Me and my flying partner were up to the 300NM sortie (CPL NAV requirement). As we are doing back to back so our flight is going to cover 600nm, probably half of the north island? Yeah and for the past two times we had canceled our flight due to weather…Its kinda hard to have good weather around that much area at that time of the year…We got a bit frustrated because of all the effort we have spent for the past 2 times did not made us fly. So we waited until the day we saw our name on the schedule for tomorrow. On that night I went to my flying partners place and we spent couple of hours to discuss the weather, reconsidered the route and finished half of the flight plan ( because we need the wind information in the morning). We had done what we could have done prior to the day of flight and both of us had a good rest as it was a morning flight. The next day we arrived milson and we had another serious discussion on the current meteorological info. And…again…we decided to cancel it, and we talked to the duty instructor and he AGREED to sign our cancellation as well. By that time we were really really frustrated indeed and we went to inform the ops controller that we have canceled the flight due to weather. When he was changing the color of our flight to red on the resource planner (indicating cancellation), a C cat instructor walked into ops area with a coffee and ask the controller why is that flight being canceled. The controller answered him due to weather, and he said… "WHAT? I CAN SEE TAUPO FROM HERE" (from the window at ops i assumed). The controller did not say a word but gave him a little smile…We were relatively close to that area so we heard their conversion and we were even more frustrated and ANGRY.

POINTS TO NOTICE:

1. We want to fly too. We have wasted so many hours of effort and preparation for this flight.
2. The Duty Instructor ( B cat) had agreed on the decision we have made.
3. What could we say?

good airmanship begins in the school

CXWX (guest) 31 Jan 2009 07:51

Good Ab-initio airmanship must first be displayed by the practices of the school; it is through these influences and culture that the norm of portraying good airmanship becomes part of a student's character

At the school where I was training for my PPL, I noticed that there were a many good airmanship practices, below are a few suggestions:

1. As the student pilots in the flying school were also students from another institution, there was a Risk Assessment System which calculated the fitness of a Student pilot to fly. It was the responsibility of the student pilot to plan his day before the flight to ensure that his fatigue levels are low when graded by the system. This creates a habit of resting and preparation for flight in the student hopefully which will become permanent.

2. The clearance to fly was the decision of the student, however a formal weather assesment tool was also provided, it took into consideration the outside temperature, the cloud base, the coud cover, visability and so on. this tool also trained us to make more accurate weather predictions as we had a system of evaluation. If such a system did not exist, we could have missed out certain important points which could be of danget. ( eg runway to hot to take off ( a phenomenon common in singapore ) I realise that now that i've graduated, I still evaluate the weather the same way as I did with the system, not just with "gut feelings".

3. Although we had the prerogative not to fly if we did not like the weather, we have to bear with the consequences. The slight annoyance with the cancellation of a training flight is definitely small compared to the reaction that we woruld receive should we cancel a flight of commercial value. I definitely agree that Faddy was right in cancelling his flights, however, for the sake of safety, he should take his instructor's words with a pinch of salt. It is good Airmanship to decide to cancel the flight for safety, regardless of the reaction of our bosses, customers or instructors.

4. The school also had a very strong climate of safety. Everything that is done revolved around Safety. the solos had a cover plane to ensure safety, safety meetings were held monthly, and every action had to be preceeded with the question, Is that safe? This had also stuck with me througout my flying career. Is it safe to land? Is it safe to go there? is the aircraft safe to fly in? This is not a form of paranoia. It is better to ask and check, then to assume that it is safe.

These and many more are just part of the culture that cultivates good airmanship. The school is where a normal person gains his wings, and the culture of the school itself determines the type of pilot the student becomes.

Being Rushed

Anonymous (203.184.26.x) 30 Oct 2008 04:49

One CPL nav I had pre planned a couple routes at home before going into the flight school, i got to there 2 hours before my flight time and started assessing weather and filling out my flight plans. I had 2 flights to the north and one to the south planned, the one to the south was across the straight which I had done before and was competent with. Weather south looked the best so I put in the winds for my assigned altitude and took my flight plan to the duty instructor, he was in a briefing with another student and was very annoyed that I had disturbed him, it was about half an hour before my flight departure time and I was pushing to get back before ETC already. I waited a good half an hour more and checked and rechecked to see if I had everything, the instructor finally went over my flight plan with me and we spent 15 mins so I was 45 mins late, he told me to hurry up and get in the plane so I picked up all my stuff and took off. Halfway across the cook straight I realised I didnt pick up my life jacket, I immediately contacted wellington control and advised I was turning back and diverting off to masterton. This was good diversion practice anyway.

My analysis of why I forgot the lifejacket was simply because I was rushed by the instructor not making time for me.

A simple little checklist in my notebook would have prevented this on the ground and I could have completed the planned flight

Re: Ab-initio PRESSURE-INDUCED INCIDENTS

turbo1 10 Nov 2008 19:59

Rushed
We were to complete a back-to-back nav. flight from PM to NP via the desert road home. The leg up went without misshap, so wer secured the plane and stopped for lunch. However we were in a hurry to leavce as lunch had taken too long. Because of this we were carryig out radio calls, checklists etc. while moving and all contributing (a bit each) thus alleviating some of the pilot's workload and expeciting. We took-off and proceeded with the flight with NP in the distance we began to feel cold and then identified a nose from overhead. As it turned out the door was not secured correctly with about a two finger width gap of sky showing through. We slowed the aircraft and opened and closed the door correctly before returning to normal speed and continued with the flight.

Unauthorized descent at Palmerston North

edmarlo 03 Feb 2010 01:43

This incident was related to me by a friend, John, on a solo navigation exercise. John was made to track back from Hunterville to Palmerston at 1500 feet. Approximately 5 miles north of Bunnythorpe, John established contact with Palmerston Tower and was instructed to make a Bunnythorpe Arrival and to continue downwind for runway 07, maintaining 1500 ( 400 feet above circuit height). ATC instructed him to stay above circuit height due to traffic that was on late downwind. John had never before been given such a clearance and this was the point where John started getting confused (it is normally the practise to descent to 1100 feet before joining downwind).

When John was very late downwind, he made an unauthorized descent to circuit height and continued approach as number 2 with the aircraft ahead on short finals. This was of course detected by ATC although no further calls were made by ATC.

A report was filed against John for the unauthorized descent he made and a written explanation was expected of him. This incident was clearly due to inexperience. John was unsure of ATC's instructions and chose to follow the practice which he has been used to. The lesson learnt in this experience is to always strictly follow ATC instructions. It is their responsibility to separate VFR traffic and tower personnel would definitely have a much bigger and clearer picture of the traffic and their associated heights within the aerodrome. Another key lesson to highlight would be the importance of a good read-back. Many a times, pilots read back ATC clearances acknowledging whatever instructions that have been issued, but not fully comprehending what is to be expected. Ab-initio pilots especially should make it a point to fully understand ATC clearances and not hesitate clarify with ATC should any ambiguities arise.

Re: Ab-initio PRESSURE-INDUCED INCIDENTS

dotwikifan 07 Aug 2010 12:44

This is about the CPL navigation flight I was flying from PM- NR( Napier)-YP-MS-PM. After reaching DV I requested NR control to enter their airspace at 5000 feet on the way to NR with my ETA. I was cleared and initially requested to track to Hasting aerodrome. After that, my instructor asked me to notify few towns on the way which I identified correctly. Also, NR ATC asked me to report my position. I rushed to report my position and ended up making a mistake. I also remember saying something like 14nm from aerodrome. I did not realize NR DME is almost 1 north of the runway. Lessons learned here are : Firstly, do not rush to report your position. It is better to take your time than to report it wrongly. Secondly, make sure where the DME is in relation to the run way. It is not always close to or next to the airfield. By now I am scared that I made few errors. Although it was an error, it was not that significant for me to fail the flight test and put safety in jeopardy. At that moment, I was stressed and work load increased during landing phase. Thirdly, I learned that I should have left what happened and thought of the flight onwards. I request for touch and go departing South. Soon I was cleared to join left hand down wind for RWY 16. I read back correctly. I am on down wind for RWY 16. As I was going to turn base, I was told to extend down wind. I did as I was advised and tuned to base soon after they cleared me. I was on short final. They came up with my call sign and gave me long clearance which I have never heard before. I read back as they told me. I did not write down the clearance like I usually do. I could not write it down. Who would write clearance on short finals? I touch down and took off. Soon after I was given Engine failure after take off ( EFATO). I was busy looking and found the field that was on my right hand side of the RWY.

By now I forgot the unusual clearance that was given to me. There was a/c coming towards me to land therefore the tower advised me to turn left and track towards the city and to South onwards after that. That clearance would ensure me to be well cleared from that a/c. I did start turning left but it was not fast enough as tower was expecting me to. The biggest mistake I made was not telling ATC to stand by when he gave me long clearance on short finals. I was not 100% sure where exactly Napier city was( that is where ATC cleared me to track to start with). After EFATO, I should have asked ATC to read back my clearance again and ask where exactly Napier City was. I did not do either of them thus failing the test as there was a/c coming to land. Although I had the aircraft in site, I failed to follow ATC instruction.

Lessons to be learnt here are: Do not rush to do position report. You can always tell ATC to stand by especially when you are on critical stages of flights and are busy in cockpit. If unsure, ask for help and request them to read back the clearance and ask for assistance.

the pressure of trying to get home and its result (fully survivable but not to be done again)

dagger20 10 Oct 2010 04:57

i was on a flight earlier this year with a fellow student (i myself a student as well) , the route was from palmerston north to ardmore via taumarnui, hamilton. then return through through waikato plains down to tauop, dessert road then through to palmy. we got ardmore around 12:30pm and wished to back around before 4pm as a friend of mine had a drivers license test to do and he needed my car. so i flew up to ardmore with no problems except abit of cloud doging on the way up as can be expected around the te kuiti area.

i was comfortable with ardmore area, airspace and traffic as i had previosuly flown there for a year before starting training at massey. so there was no problems for me, however after planning for return trip. from the point of getting into the aircraft, things were about to go somewhat lop-sided. we shut the hatch and were already somewhat running late on getting back. the pilot in command who was my other class mate, started his taxi, the first thing i did wrong was shut the door without securing my shoulder harness on, i said i was "going to put it on before the line up". as we taxied out to the run up area, it was a prefectly sunny way in which all the training schools were out and the run up area littered with about 6 aircraft in a line running up in some orderly fashion. as my mate was new to this aerodrome he had no idea what to do. I myself had no idea either, as this was somehting new that i never seen in my time before. so we found our own bit of turf to run up on. i didnt know this but it had made the PIC nervious and ended up being a a rush of a run up and pre take off check, as he just wanted to get out of there ASAP, in doing this quite fast, i had overlooked my shoulder harness being secured and i called "secured" when he asked for "hatches and harnessesd". he lined up onto the runway, already nervious at the ammount of traffic and started his take off roll, he rotated the aircraft and their suddenly became a large knocking sound on the airframe.

you guessed it, it was my shoulder harness that was not secured, i had shut the door with the harness strap left hanging outside. when asked what it was, i told the pic it was my shoulder harness, a couple of expeltives came out but lo and behold infront of him was a aircraft, who was simulating an EFATO, this caused the pilot to be further stressed with the banging sound and not being familiar with the airport surroundings and operations. luckily i helped him out with the aircraft simulating but the banging sound stopped. the result of this rush, was the metal buckle of the shoulder harness making it way up to the corner of the right side, rear widow, and blowing a hole in purspex window where the buckle became wedged. once we reliased what had happen, i assured the pilot that we are unpressurised and that all its going to expierence is abit of extra air conditioning. (which was needed for that day, as the vents were not adaquate). we continued on our journey south of ardmore in which once we were clear ot the area, we cunducted the door decuring procedure from the QRH and retrive the buckle and continue flying back to palmerston north unevenful.

moral of this story - first would be don;t fly with me :P, no but really it is a lesson that we are always warned about in our studies and take for granted when you have been flying long enough. this is not to rush things, no matter how routine or how simple it is, it will catch u out one day. and this day it did. we were stressed about the new enviroment we were in, the ammount of traffic, the fast pace of the operations in and out of ardmore, put us in abit of a shock and awe on the ground which made us in the end hurry just to get to the saftey of the air in which we could get away from it all so we can get home. i did take responsability about what happened with my shoulder harness but the pic who to this day will never fly with me again(jokingly :D), did get copped as well for not visually checking and somewhat rushing the pre-take off checks. so in the end do not rush your checks, and also when operating in a new enviroment or aerdrome that is unfamilillar i should have taken the time out to brief the my fellow class mate on the ins and outs of ardmore as this was his first time there. this would have been good airmenship and would of allowed for a much safer and less risker flight.

PRESSURE TO GET BACK -06174345 (guest) 12 Oct 2010 00:56

I had around 40 hours PIC to complete in 4 weeks. I had my C-cat test date set (in concrete - If we missed this date, the next would be more than a month away and it had already been pushed back once) and my plan from the start was to leave a bunch of hours till closer to my C-cat so I would be really current. Any how, I had planned to go see my brother in Dunedin a couple of weeks before my date (the pressure was on as this flight alone would burn around 10 hours that i needed desperately. I had my mum with me and the weather looked fine enough to get down there. The only concern was the westerly coming over the southern alps and to beware of turbulence. It looked marginal to come back but the weather system was moving faster than expected and I decided to go. The trip down was cool, a bit longer than expected because we had to fly at 2500ft instead of the planned 8500. We went down on the friday and were planning to be back on the sunday at lunchtime (mum was heading up to hamilton by car that afternoon and still had to pack - this dunedin trip was touch and go for a bit, we thought we may not end up going). Oh, another guy in my course was also flying down to dunedin that same weekend, and another to christchurch and all flights went ahead.
The flight back was a different story. From dunedin to christchurch the cloud was quite low and broken (covering more than half the sky) in most places. It was fine to navigate though, I just followed the coast and always had a paddock (the beach) in mind. If it was worse than this across the straight I would not have been keen to cross. So Mum was wondering how the heck she was gonna get packed in time to get to hamilton (others were relying on her for rides too). Luckily the was fine from kaikoura across the straight but from just north of parapaumu onwards it was solid cloud. I was lucky I was very familiar with the area else it would have been very difficult to navigate and keep orientated. We were pushed down to 600ft. I had in the back of my mind that the guy who went to christchurch was coming back today and would either be around here or have just made it back to palmerston north. So i listen for him, didn't hear anything and decided he must have made it back. So i thought, there must be a gap somewhere. I had automatically entered the poor visibility configuration and started tracking out towards the coast. After a couple of seconds to ponder, i decided to divert to foxpine (foxton). A low level circuit and quite a bit of a crosswind made me determined to make this one a good landing (not a go-around). Jenny (foxpines owner) and her daughter were there and offered a hot drink. After consulting her (she is an instructor too) and just over an hour on the ground waiting for it to clear, we made it back to Palmy special VFR.
An hour after that, the other classmate who went to dunedin too came back and said it was clear skies.
It just goes to show how quickly the weather can change and how your decisions can result life/death situations. If I had continued to Palmy instead of diverting, not only would it have been illegal, I would not have been fulfilling my obligation as pilot on command in keeping the aircraft and its occupants safe. I am glad I had that experience now as I now know for sure I can handle high stress situations - before you have one you never really know how you are going to react (sims dont count). And I will need to Because I passed my C-cat and am a qualified instructor. If a CPL student gets into these situations, imagine what a pre-solo student will do!

PRESSURE TO GET BACK -06174345 (guest) 12 Oct 2010 01:00

I guess this post should really have gone under the 'decision making' section

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